Trying to find info on Zimbabwean cricket history....

[JHunter]

Hi all, I'm new. I'm not Zimbabwean, but of course I'm not a spammer since I got the capital question right.

So, I've been trying to find info on Zimbabwean (and Rhodesian) cricketing history. I understand that the Logan Cup was started in the early 1900s (1903 or 1904 I think) and named after James D Logan who donated a trophy in 1899 after Lord Hawke's visit. After that though it's a literal desert when it comes to information except for one reference in 1972 which talked about the Logan Cup following the rules of the Gillette Cup (doesn't matter which Gillette Cup since there were about 5 different Gillette Cups across England, the West Indies, Australia, New Zealand and South Africa in the 1970s and all were one day competitions) for the first time. From that I was able to infer that between 1904 and 1972 the Logan Cup was not one-day cricket and must therefore have been multi-day cricket (most likely 3-day cricket). When the Logan Cup became a first-class competition in 1993/1994 that is when records show up at cricketarchive and cricinfo. I also see that starting in 1996/1997 there was a Logan Cup one day competition (list A cricket) separate from the first-class Logan Cup. What I would really like to know is what was the format (or formats) of the Logan Cup from 1904 until 1994. Was it multi-day cricket? Specifically 3-day cricket? Or was it 2-day cricket? Or 1-day cricket? I know it was not first-class until 1993/94 and as I found out there was at least a plan for it to be (presumably) a 1-day tournament in 1972 or thereabouts, but did it become a 1-day competition in 1973 and stay that way until 1994 or was a separate 1 day section introduced in the 1970s? Did it briefly become a 1-day competition and then revert to a multi-day tournament before Zimbabwe's independence in 1980 and Zim's affiliation with the ICC in 1981 as an associate?


I've been trying to find out about the history of cricket in all of the full members and in some associates and affiliates. From what I have found it would appear that all full members played domestic multi-day cricket before becoming full members. England had the Champion County determined from relatively unorganized county cricket from the 1700s (later County Championship developed in 1889/90); Australia had Inter-Colonial Cricket (1850s) and later the Sheffield Shield (1890s), South Africa had the Champion Bat competition (a 2-day competition) and later the Currie Cup. India had various miscellaneous matches going back to the 1860s which were 3-day matches followed by the Bombay Series (with various incarnations as the Bombay Presidency match, Bombay Triangular, Bombay Qaudrangular, Bombay Pentagular) in the 1890s and then the Ranji trophy in the 1930s. Pakistan has always had first-class matches since it separated from India in 1947 and had traditional fixtures involving Punjab, Punjab University, Punjab Governor's XI and Sind before the Quaid-E-Azam trophy in the 1950s. West Indies had domestic first-class matches from the 1860s followed by the Inter-Colonial Tournament (1890s) and then the Shell Shield (1960s), New Zealand also had first-class matches in the 1860s and then established the Plunket(t) Shield in 1906. Sri Lanka had a traditional 2-day fixture (Europeans v. Ceylonese going back to the 1880s) and various other 3-day matches in the the 1930s onwards (including a Rohiton Baria trophy in the 1940s) and a 3-day tournament now known as the Premier Trophy which started in 1938 (as the Daily News Trophy). None of Sri Lanka's domestic matches were first class unless they involved a touring team (since the ICC tightened the regulations concerning first-class cricket in the late 1940s and made it impossible for non full-member boards to declare matches first-class - so only full members or the ICC itself could declare matches or tournaments first-class in nature). Bangladesh was a bit tricker - part of India until 1947 and then part of Pakistan until 1971 it had first-class cricket until then. Haven't found much on multi-day cricket in Bangladesh after that. Thanks to some helpful Bangladeshis and resources on the internet it seems that there wasn't any multi-day cricket in Bangladesh (not sure when after 1971 it ended) until the mid-to-late 1990s when a 2-day (90 overs per side) league was instituted in preparation for 3-day cricket. There was a 3-day final match to the Bangladesh national league in 1997 and in 1999 for sure all matches in the league were 3-day. For Zimbabwe though as a outlined above information is so scarce I think it might be easier to find water in the Kalahari.

With the present associates and affiliates the only country I know of that has a history of multi-day cricket and still plays domestic multi-day cricket is.....Argentina (I know, weird right?). They have a traditional North v. South match (a 3-day match) that has been played since the 1800s.

Thanks for taking the time to read this and if any of you have any answers I would be most grateful.

[liamb]

Get hold of Jonty Winch's 'Cricket's Rich Heritage: A History of the Rhodesia and Zimbabwe National Sides' which will tell you all you need to know.

[JHunter]

Get hold of Jonty Winch's 'Cricket's Rich Heritage: A History of the Rhodesia and Zimbabwe National Sides' which will tell you all you need to know.

Thanks for the suggestion, but that book costs between US$35 and US$100 depending on who is selling it. That's an awful lot of money (not including shipping from Abe Books or Amazon and then the shipping charges at which ever company I would use to bring it in) to answer a simple question (which is at the heart of everything I wrote before): Was the Logan Cup a multi-day competition between 1978 and 1991?

I was really hoping that someone on here would know. It's almost hard to believe that this thread got 44 views but only one reply. Surely somebody should know.

[JHunter]

You see I'm beginning to suspect that we won't see any more test playing nations because almost all the nations which have some interest in multi-day cricket at home (except Argentina) are already test nations. I know Kenya tried to set up a 3-day league but that got scrapped with the election violence some years ago. The Dutch had plans for a 2-day league but it hasn't gotten off the ground (for various reasons I suppose). The Irish despite all their wailing about how the ICC is unfair haven't even planned any multi-day domestic cricket (which is why I don't think they are really serious about becoming a full member - they seem to want to become the first full member that completely parasitizes off the domestic competition of another full member which would be England). I think the Scots have plans for multi-day cricket but I don't know if it has gotten anywhere yet. Malaysia and Singapore play 3-day cricket, but it is only international cricket (a tournament between themselves) so unless they joined together and turned that competition into a domestic tournament the only country left that has any multi-day cricket at home and would thus have taken the first real step to being a test nation is Argentina (oddly enough).

[sloandog]

You see I'm beginning to suspect that we won't see any more test playing nations because almost all the nations which have some interest in multi-day cricket at home (except Argentina) are already test nations. I know Kenya tried to set up a 3-day league but that got scrapped with the election violence some years ago. The Dutch had plans for a 2-day league but it hasn't gotten off the ground (for various reasons I suppose). The Irish despite all their wailing about how the ICC is unfair haven't even planned any multi-day domestic cricket (which is why I don't think they are really serious about becoming a full member - they seem to want to become the first full member that completely parasitizes off the domestic competition of another full member which would be England). I think the Scots have plans for multi-day cricket but I don't know if it has gotten anywhere yet. Malaysia and Singapore play 3-day cricket, but it is only international cricket (a tournament between themselves) so unless they joined together and turned that competition into a domestic tournament the only country left that has any multi-day cricket at home and would thus have taken the first real step to being a test nation is Argentina (oddly enough).

I'd love to answer your questions mate, i really would, since that's why the forum was initially made (for discussions and for any questions). But in my opinion, if 44 people have viewed this, i doubt many will actually know the answer.
My suggestion is to keep searching, since what you're looking for will be hard to come by...
Sorry again

[maehara]

You see I'm beginning to suspect that we won't see any more test playing nations because almost all the nations which have some interest in multi-day cricket at home (except Argentina) are already test nations.

Stepping off-topic for a moment: the problem with multi-day cricket in this day & age is that it almost by definition requires your players to be professionals, because very few employers are going to give them the regular time off that would be needed to compete in a multi-day competition.

The requirement for potential Full Members to have a "financially self-sustaining first class competition", as believe the ICC's requirements read, is also a bit of a red herring - there isn't a financially self-sustaining first class competition in existence anywhere, they all survive off the proceeds of T20 and international matches (domestic 40/50 over is usually loss-making as well, I believe) - which is why Ireland and the others haven't bothered setting multi-day competitions up. They need what limited income they have for their national sides.

As for your main question... genuinely, it's hard enough digging up the recent history of Zimbabwean cricket, and most of us here weren't around during the periods you're looking for. You could try asking ZC directly (desk@zimcricket.org), but other than that liamb knows his stuff and has pointed you in the direction of a likely source of what you're looking for. That's probably the best reply we can manage. Even we don't have all the answers, sadly...

[Dr_Situ(ZimFanatic)]

I was really hoping that someone on here would know. It's almost hard to believe that this thread got 44 views but only one reply. Surely somebody should know.

I think the best person to contact is John Ward. He was assistant editor of Zimbabwe CricInfo earlier and edited Zimbabwe Cricket Online for many years. When Cricinfo sold out to Wisden, they unfortunately had no further time for ZCO and it had to be discontinued. He has a wealth of knowledge but he is not part of this forum. Mail me (dr.satendra@gmail.com) and i will give you his email address

[Dr_Situ(ZimFanatic)]

Here's John's reply for JHunter

Hello, Satendra, as far as I can remember, between 1904 and 1994 the Logan Cup was a two-day competition all the way through (Saturdays and Sundays, as all players were amateurs), although it sounds from what the guy said as if there was a short period that I don't remember when it became a one-day competition. Unfortunately ZC never kept records, so there are no scorecards available, but I did some newspaper research in the past when I had more time and all through those years (possibly with the odd brief exception that the guy noted) it was two-day cricket. Jonty Winch's book is now almost 30 years old, and I can't find my copy right now, but it's probably no longer obtainable and it didn't give much coverage to the Logan Cup. I think this answers his questions about as best as I can. -- John

[eugene]

Too bad that John Ward isn't on this forum. At the very least an official ZCF interview with him would be a good feature for this forum. He has so much knowledge about Zimbabwean cricket and I would be interested to know what his feelings on the current situation with Zimbabwean cricket are.

[JHunter]

Here's John's reply for JHunter

Hello, Satendra, as far as I can remember, between 1904 and 1994 the Logan Cup was a two-day competition all the way through (Saturdays and Sundays, as all players were amateurs), although it sounds from what the guy said as if there was a short period that I don't remember when it became a one-day competition. Unfortunately ZC never kept records, so there are no scorecards available, but I did some newspaper research in the past when I had more time and all through those years (possibly with the odd brief exception that the guy noted) it was two-day cricket. Jonty Winch's book is now almost 30 years old, and I can't find my copy right now, but it's probably no longer obtainable and it didn't give much coverage to the Logan Cup. I think this answers his questions about as best as I can. -- John

Thanks, thanks, thanks a million! I figured it was something like that.

Tell Mr. Ward thanks for me and give him these links which he might find useful and interesting:

http://static.cricinfo.com/db/ARCHIVE/1 ... 72_MR.html - this has the reference to the Logan Cup being played under Gillette Cup rules (though really it only talks about plans for the Logan Cup to be played under Gillette Cup rules, it doesn't say if it actually happened. If John Ward remembers the Logan Cup being a 2-day competition all the time then perhaps they never did implement Gillette Cup rules and instead started another competition).

http://www.abebooks.com/CRICKETS-RICH-H ... 4540582/bd - Jonty Winch's book at the cheapest price I could find it (US$30). Other online stores (http://www.amazon.com/gp/search?index=b ... 0869202561) have it selling for $40-$80 but they do have Winch's 1994 book which might talk about the Logan Cup.