Rwanda v Zimbabwe | ICC T20 Qualifier | 27 November 2023

[secretzimbo]

We heard you the first 40 times you've posted that.

[andrea lanzoni]

We heard you the first 40 times you've posted that.

No one have agreed or disagreed.
What's your opinion?

[ZIMDOGGY]

It makes you wonder where we’d be without the $12m a year we get from the ICC. Some of these African associates get less than $100k per year.

If cricket was equitable we’d probably be outside the top 50. Several other current full members probably would be too!

We literally get 100x more funding than Uganda and yet they beat us. Crazy really

With "only" 2 out of 12 million $, you can pay an average monthly 1.500 $ salary, for 12 months to 100 players.
Out of 100 players, dedicated to cricket the whole year, Zimbabwe can reasonably hope to harvest 10-15 players who would be competitive for international standards.

Indeed the rough math I made gets up to 1.8 million. The remainder 200.000$ can be used for coaches and umpire/scorer allowance.

After this there are still 10 million left to mismanage/waste/deplete....

But at least Zimbabwe would have a bedrock of 100 professional players and a number of coaches, umpires, scorers around them.

There are only about 500 cricket playing people in the whole country and you want to pay 20% of them?
Which, btw, I said to you a year ago.

[pillowprocter]

It makes you wonder where we’d be without the $12m a year we get from the ICC. Some of these African associates get less than $100k per year.

If cricket was equitable we’d probably be outside the top 50. Several other current full members probably would be too!

We literally get 100x more funding than Uganda and yet they beat us. Crazy really

With "only" 2 out of 12 million $, you can pay an average monthly 1.500 $ salary, for 12 months to 100 players.
Out of 100 players, dedicated to cricket the whole year, Zimbabwe can reasonably hope to harvest 10-15 players who would be competitive for international standards.

Indeed the rough math I made gets up to 1.8 million. The remainder 200.000$ can be used for coaches and umpire/scorer allowance.

After this there are still 10 million left to mismanage/waste/deplete....

But at least Zimbabwe would have a bedrock of 100 professional players and a number of coaches, umpires, scorers around them.

There are only about 500 cricket playing people in the whole country and you want to pay 20% of them?
Which, btw, I said to you a year ago.

Tbf, if 100 players got paid then alot more people would look at cricket as a genuine career

[ZIMDOGGY]

With "only" 2 out of 12 million $, you can pay an average monthly 1.500 $ salary, for 12 months to 100 players.
Out of 100 players, dedicated to cricket the whole year, Zimbabwe can reasonably hope to harvest 10-15 players who would be competitive for international standards.

Indeed the rough math I made gets up to 1.8 million. The remainder 200.000$ can be used for coaches and umpire/scorer allowance.

After this there are still 10 million left to mismanage/waste/deplete....

But at least Zimbabwe would have a bedrock of 100 professional players and a number of coaches, umpires, scorers around them.

There are only about 500 cricket playing people in the whole country and you want to pay 20% of them?
Which, btw, I said to you a year ago.

Tbf, if 100 players got paid then alot more people would look at cricket as a genuine career

A cricket career in Zimbabwe is the lowest hanging fruit of any test nations.
In Australia you’d need to go through 10x flights of club cricket levels to get to a paid level. Maybe 1 in 500 gets paid.

And people here wanting to pay any old jahash who can hold a bat money?
Sorry it’s just a retarded take.
Also remember there are some unique challenges Zimbabwe face.
One that sticks out to me is no one pats any registration fees.
ZC fund the entirety of cricket.
Anywhere else rego pays off balls (these are not cheap, 40 euro a pop) umpires, maintenance you name it.
In Zimbabwe it’s all funded because everyone’s broke and can’t afford even a small fee

[secretzimbo]

There's a lot more that goes into running cricket than just paying players. It's really not as simple as our Italian friend suggests.

For a start a minimum % of our ICC funding is required to be spent on women's and girls cricket and this is closely monitored by the ICC.

Then we have the issue that nobody else at any level puts any money into cricket here. ZC are expected to fund absolutely everything at every level. HSC is not cheap to maintain to the level it is maintained at - things aren't cheap here, especially reliable power, water, specialist equipment etc and the relevant people employed to do so. Similarly ZC has to chip in to maintain most other grounds in the country to keep them at a sufficient standard - again it's not cheap. Without ZC funding most of the grounds would be ruinous. Indeed we've seen that in past years when ZC has had no money.

Then you have club cricket, again very few clubs raise or collect any funds themselves and players don't pay subs or fees like they do in England (or possibly Italy?) or anywhere else in the world. ZC funds a lot of the club cricket you see happening.

Then there is schools cricket. The private schools are mostly fine but parents at government schools contribute 0 (Don't get Googly started on this) and again most get a grant or subsidy from ZC to keep school cricket continuing at the small handful of schools that still play it.

Then there are coaches at grassroots, club and school levels. Whether we agree it's a good approach or not, ZC currently funds around a dozen or so qualified coaches to live in the provinces and other areas, and their coaching activities in these areas.

Then there is international cricket, the costs of which are astronomical. ZC makes a net loss at almost every international full-status fixture it hosts. Maybe the big crowds in Harare in recent times have helped balance the books a bit. But generally it is loss making. When we tour it is even more so. The tour to Australia cost a bloody fortune apparently last year. It's not cheap to get 20+ people from Harare to these far flung parts of the world, and house and feed them for 2 weeks plus the associated equipment expenses and match fees and insurance and everything else. Home series are even worse because ZC have to pay the mandatory ICC ACU and umpiring fees which are huge, especially in ODI and Tests (I think the requirements are lower for T20I's but don't quote me).

Then we have franchise cricket which isn't as simple as just paying 22 guys to go and play. ZC insists on playing at grounds around the country. Whether this is worth the cost is another debate. It would be much cheaper to jut do absolutely everything in Harare but I understand the other argument of spreading the game and trying to have identity amongst the franchises. But every fixture that Eagles play in Masvingo - again, there is a cost to transport, hotel, food for the entire squad.
Hilariously some of the outer sports clubs charge ZC a rental to play a game there, despite the fact ZC separately subsidises the upkeep of the ground anyway

Then you have umpires, match referees, scorers and groundstaff to pay (and equip, and house, and feed).

And it's not jut 22 guys playing. Each franchise has at least 3-4 coaches/staff present at matches, and it's important they are paid well too.

Then you have the cost of kits and equipment and balls.

Then you have the cost of paying the various administrators, board and staff involved in the organisation or cricket at all levels and making stuff actually happen.

Then you have the millions of dollars they need to waste in Vic Falls and the 20% of the ICC allocation that needs to mysteriously disappear into pockets every year

[secretzimbo]

I'm pretty sure franchise contracts have increased over the past year or two. I don't think the famed $600/month contracts still exist. But I don't know what the actual amounts are now.

Also the national team players and coaches are currently very very well paid. That eats a huge chunk into the overall budget.

Don't forget the shiny new cars thats all the board and admins drive around too

Tbf the accounts are audited these days. They are usually available to download somewhere on the ZC website. They break down the expenses.

[andrea lanzoni]

There are only about 500 cricket playing people in the whole country and you want to pay 20% of them?
Which, btw, I said to you a year ago.

I remember you reported that there are 500 cricketers in Zimbabwe a year ago. That's why I still think that 100 should be professionals.
The ratio of professionals is not to be tied to the total of cricketers, rather on the sustainability of the budget.

Since we are talking about future chances to retain 12 million for the years to come, first thing is to make sure that Zimbabwe stays afloat in international competitions, otherwise a good chunk of the pie will be given to other (more competitive) nations.

Sure you have to show that ZC takes care of women cricket, under 19-17-15-13 etc., sure there are other parametres. However if all that seeding does not give fruit, the ICC funding will shrink (maybe dramatically).

I advocate investing 15% of present ICC funding for a bedrock of local professional cricketers that sensibly can make us optimistic to harvest a dozen of international standard players.
You have no alternative: someone claims to import from the diaspora someone else reply that in the diaspora the quality is low as well.
So no magic wand as of now: neither locally or from the diaspora.

The investment is to be made locally. I pegged it at 15% of ICC funding. If from these professionals in 2-3 years you get valid substitute of present (old) best three, etc. then the bet has been successful.
I do not see more viable alternatives in the short-medium term.

My proposal leaves a sound 85% of the ICC budget to be spent in everything else.
I wouldn't be so biased to feel unable to manage all other expenses with 85% of annual ICC funding.
In other words: I feel optimistic that there's space to better managing that 85% remainder.

So far it seems to me that a policy which gives priority to grant players a living is not been applied.

Sounds an elite cricket proposal? Not at all: by showing that ZC means truly business for the living of his cricketers, in the short-medium term you will see thousands of new avid and vibrant players in Zimbabwe.
In other words: the 500 cricketers you deem you have now will be just a memory of a (mismanaged?) past.

[TapsC2]

However ZC is using their funds, the ICC know about it now and clearly approve of it. A lot has changed since the suspension. You will find a lot of the issues people have with these guys are from before the suspension.

It's also very clear that the ICC will protect their own so a boardroom coup anywhere is extremely unlikely

[Googly]

Youve got about 3 years to impliment your strategy and get results. Aint going to happen.
Some, but not all of the national squad get a living wage (or a good one, but nothing like the top admin guys).
A fair percentage of the franchise guys get some money for 4 months of the year. There are a few favorites amongst them. Others are on a pay as you play. A few are on pay to play

This won't change.
By giving journeymen cricketers a year round wage you're being nice, you may improve the standard slightly if you tie the year round salary to a commitment to practice or play in the off season. I doubt one of those guys will repay that sort of investment by becoming good enough for national selection. How does that encourage thousands to play? They're not going to pay them. New players know they're waiting for people to retire, die, or play really badly for 3 years in a row before there's room.
There is some provision to get noticed in the NPL to be fair.

If you want to improve the small number that have a higher ceiling you need to get them into an academy in the off season and pay them so they can survive. That's the most efficient way of doing it. It seems so obvious that I have to assume there are some plans afoot, but maybe not. There are a few "Academies" but I doubt they even own a cricket bat.

Spare money is best spent getting age group cricket functioning and identifying good school kids.

ZC need club cricket to improve and ideally be more financially independent which is unlikely. They broke it and now can't fix it. A couple of clubs make an effort to raise funds for themselves, but most await the stipend from ZC.

Only one way to get thousands to play and that's for the national side to win some games. Solve that problem in the short term and you've got everyone's attention.