You never shared on which players signed a letter backing the board. Maybe you can work backwards and tell us who didnt sign it?Googly wrote: ↑Tue Oct 15, 2019 8:24 pmDoes ICC send money for the time we were suspended I wonder?
There are some fat cats there on 15-30k a month, if you multiply that by 4 months that’s at least half a million that’s going to the hierarchy. They’ll pay themselves way before the players, plus there’s some coke and buns to dish out for the people who played their part, hopefully they get cheated
They’re going to have a tough time dodging games because there’s an air of expectation and they’re under the spotlight for a bit, but they’ll manage to keep the game time to a minimum, watch and see, not one game more than necessary will be organized.
Lifting of ZC suspension on the 8th
Re: Lifting of ZC suspension on the 8th
Re: Lifting of ZC suspension on the 8th
I agree. I want this list. Not for nefarious reasons, but purely because I think as fans, we have a right to know which players are making decisions that are damning the team and the game and subjecting the fans to such mediocrity and terrible administration. We have a right to know which players care for the fans and which don't.
At least that's my view.
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chesterton
- Posts: 104
- Joined: Sun Sep 08, 2019 8:40 pm
Re: Lifting of ZC suspension on the 8th
It is my opinion, based on a few posts here, that players are backing who they think will win, not who they want to win.zimbos_05 wrote: ↑Wed Oct 16, 2019 9:00 amI agree. I want this list. Not for nefarious reasons, but purely because I think as fans, we have a right to know which players are making decisions that are damning the team and the game and subjecting the fans to such mediocrity and terrible administration. We have a right to know which players care for the fans and which don't.
At least that's my view.
I think there’s a strong perception in the Shona community that revenge tactics are strong. Whether true or not, players (and people) are afraid they will be penalised down the line if they get it wrong.
Re: Lifting of ZC suspension on the 8th
Nobody would care if they were doing a good job, every sport has the same issue where there are fat rich suits making squillions off the back of talented young sportsmen (FIFA) but as long as the players are paid looked after and the game/team are successful the fans don’t care.TapsC wrote: ↑Wed Oct 16, 2019 6:57 amThe crazy part of it all is that the ICC must know this is how much they get because they control the books. They were never going to help. I wonder how much other admins around the world get paidGoogly wrote: ↑Tue Oct 15, 2019 8:24 pmDoes ICC send money for the time we were suspended I wonder?
There are some fat cats there on 15-30k a month, if you multiply that by 4 months that’s at least half a million that’s going to the hierarchy. They’ll pay themselves way before the players, plus there’s some coke and buns to dish out for the people who played their part, hopefully they get cheated
They’re going to have a tough time dodging games because there’s an air of expectation and they’re under the spotlight for a bit, but they’ll manage to keep the game time to a minimum, watch and see, not one game more than necessary will be organized.
I challenge you to tell me one good thing ZC are doing right now, because I can’t see anything.
National men’s & women’s teams suck
No national academy or even a pathway
Under 19’s haven’t progressed past group stage in well over a decade
Best young talent going overseas
Domestic standard is pathetic
Domestic schedule is pathetic
Can’t afford to host matches at home (unless the opposition pay for it)
Haven’t played a Test in over 12 months
Haven’t hosted a Test in over 24 months ( likely to go well over 3 years)
Cant find other revenues to earn money from the game
Rely 100% on ICC funding
Can’t sell the broadcast rights for matches
School & club cricket standard is dropping & less matches being played
I could go on but surely that’s enough to say these pricks running the game don’t deserve to be in power let alone earning the type of money they are. They’ve been running the game into the ground for years mate I don’t know why you defend them.
Chairman of the Neville Madziva fan Club
Originator of the #mumbamania movement
Originator of the #mumbamania movement
Re: Lifting of ZC suspension on the 8th
A lot to be said for that statement.It is my opinion, based on a few posts here, that players are backing who they think will win, not who they want to win.
Re: Lifting of ZC suspension on the 8th
Regarding that letter-
I don’t think I said I knew the answer to that, if there was even such a letter. I’d guess there was because there would have been much politicking over the last few months. It would be quicker to guess who’d abstained.
Taps you’re right about the salary issue. These big differences in the salaries is less objectionable to guys from Third World countries, it’s what is wrong with the world in general. The ECB regulation is that a starter county contract is around £2.2k a month, I think a summer contract is around £1.2k. I think an Englishman, Aussie or New Zealander in ICC would object sooner to our ridiculous FC packages and discrepancies than someone from the sub-continent where the huge inequalities are the accepted norm- if you’re the boss you get the lion’s share, if you’re a worker then take it or leave it. It’s glum resignation and why no one will stick their necks out to change things and why it’s so easy to divide and rule and coerce someone into accepting the unacceptable.
All that had to be said to the players to terrify them was-
If this interim board gets in
1. They’re cutting this to 3 franchises
2. X,Y and Z players will come back, reducing available contracts by a further x amount.
3. They will cut squad sizes from 20 to 15.
4. Central contracts will be cut.
5. Going forward there will be less opportunities for black players, we’re going back to the 80’s and 90’s
6. Clubs won’t be supported.
7. No clubs without a home ground.
8. There will be an all white franchise.
9. They will bring back white coaches/managers
I’m fairly sure had there been a coup they would have sacked about a quarter of the players, most of whom shouldn’t really be there anyway. Well they need to be there because we are so short of players, but all things being equal a lot of guys aren’t good enough to classify as pros.
They could say anything along these lines that would cause alarm and despondency to guys’ immediate future.
Any combo of the above would have gotten players scrambling for their pens. When you’re on the breadline anyway and figure you’ve got 4 or 5 years of cricket left in you and the status quo is acceptable when compared to an uncertain future it’s a no brainer.
In my opinion this Board is not reforming nor turning anything around. They’re under pressure to now, but they’re going to blame the economy and sanctions
and we will be back to normal dismal operations quicker than you can blink.
What would that interim board have done?
Although it’s unproven I’d put my family jewels on a block that at the very least they would have rehashed that Metbank loan. We’re now never going to see the real accounts of anything and the accusations of misappropriation will never be proven or disproven. ICC have been presented with enough information over the years and have done nothing, which was the reason why SRC got involved in the first place, it was not just a personal vendetta as ZC are suggesting. The only reason they hung on is because they’ve got a lot to hide and everything to lose. Anyway that chapter is closed and I believe we’ve lost out on substantial funds that we desperately need.
Would they get players back here?
I have my doubts. They’d be shooting for a small handful of unproven young guys that have other options and would not come back to uncertainty and a failed country. What would you offer a young unproven guy? There would be an uproar, and the likes of Byrom and Welch have futures in County, hard earned as well. Muyeye is the guy they need and they need to make sure Myers and a couple of the other youngsters don’t leave.
Would the DEB board cut the franchises?
Maybe, or at least reduce the squad sizes and they’d definitely cut some of the dead wood. The current Board’s philosophy is half feed more people, and it works! Everyone seems ok with that.
Would the DEB Board have enticed corporate sponsorship?
Absolutely. Not much because the economy is shagged, but it would come and it would grow. There would be more outside interest and they’d also do a hugely better job of marketing, social media and TV rights. I’d guarantee black corporate interest! They trust this board as much as the rest of us. There’s not much white corporate left anyway.
Would the DEB board have tried to make clubs independent?
Yes- -and this would have been a painful but necessary process. My pet hate being roaming clubs of no fixed abode.
Would the DEB board organize more games?
Yes, at every single level!!
Would the DEB board have gotten some white coaches and admin back?
Here we’re talking Streak, Campbell, Taibu and Flower specifically. This would have been contentious, but I believe they would have, but would have been mindful of opinion. There’s absolutely a role for Campbell, he’s got a lot of clout and we need an A side with top coaches.
Would there have been an all white franchise?
No never, but we need more white players and they will only come or stick around if they believe that they have representation at administrative level. They rightfully don’t trust this board or previous ones. I’d personally like to see a predominately white franchise, if they like each other’s company why not, they’re not plotting a coup. Why do we need white players? Because we keep producing some really good ones, but losing them.
I could pick a mostly white franchise side that would never ever lose a game here in any format against any opposition and that would cause the 4th Chimurenga and nobody wants to see that because it proves racism and maladministration of the highest order has existed for years. They just swapped the racism out and everyone is ok with it. Sadly it’s the acid test of what has happened to our cricket and a further acid test of where the nation is at is would the public find that acceptable? We all know the answer to that one. We’ve still got a way to go as a nation. It’s hypothetical but would Zimbabwe prefer a competitive 9/11 white team or a 4/7 team that gets dry humped all day every day? The answer is very simple- everyone will clamor for the competitive team...for about 5 games only, and then the allegations of racial bias would start all over again, proving most people have learnt Jack Shit.
How would the other franchises do against a young side comprising of
Byrom, B Curran, Muyeye, Welch, Burl, Myers, Murray, S Curran, Evans, Hopper, Snater, Lake? Let’s not forget young Goodwin, a superstar in the making.
Or a heavyweight side like
Byrom, Ballance, Cartwright, Taylor, Ervine, Williams, De Grandhomme, S Curran, T Curran etc
I’ll tell you what, the other franchise side’s openers or a Zim A side’s openers could bat twice and they’d still get smashed against this second side!
The cold truth is that only a handful of people believe in this board, amongst the others there’s genuine fear of an upheaval that won’t suit individuals. There’s this perception that whites in numbers constitute a threat and a barrier. There’s some truth in that, as much as black guys gravitate to one another so do we, some would call it cultural bias and the disingenuous would call it a racial bias. It’s all about tolerance and us Zimbos have all travelled a long road in this regard. There are more black folk that live in the past than there are whites, we know our boundaries and as a fact there aren’t any for the black guys, they can say and do as they like with complete impunity. The day we see a black guy get it for racism here or SA will be a cold day in hell and I don’t think it will happen in our lifetimes. A vast section of people don’t think there is such a thing as black on white racism, that’s how fucked up the situation is. We’ve got much bigger problems than race to deal with now though, but there’s a small section that will play the card to suit forever more.
I don’t think I said I knew the answer to that, if there was even such a letter. I’d guess there was because there would have been much politicking over the last few months. It would be quicker to guess who’d abstained.
Taps you’re right about the salary issue. These big differences in the salaries is less objectionable to guys from Third World countries, it’s what is wrong with the world in general. The ECB regulation is that a starter county contract is around £2.2k a month, I think a summer contract is around £1.2k. I think an Englishman, Aussie or New Zealander in ICC would object sooner to our ridiculous FC packages and discrepancies than someone from the sub-continent where the huge inequalities are the accepted norm- if you’re the boss you get the lion’s share, if you’re a worker then take it or leave it. It’s glum resignation and why no one will stick their necks out to change things and why it’s so easy to divide and rule and coerce someone into accepting the unacceptable.
All that had to be said to the players to terrify them was-
If this interim board gets in
1. They’re cutting this to 3 franchises
2. X,Y and Z players will come back, reducing available contracts by a further x amount.
3. They will cut squad sizes from 20 to 15.
4. Central contracts will be cut.
5. Going forward there will be less opportunities for black players, we’re going back to the 80’s and 90’s
6. Clubs won’t be supported.
7. No clubs without a home ground.
8. There will be an all white franchise.
9. They will bring back white coaches/managers
I’m fairly sure had there been a coup they would have sacked about a quarter of the players, most of whom shouldn’t really be there anyway. Well they need to be there because we are so short of players, but all things being equal a lot of guys aren’t good enough to classify as pros.
They could say anything along these lines that would cause alarm and despondency to guys’ immediate future.
Any combo of the above would have gotten players scrambling for their pens. When you’re on the breadline anyway and figure you’ve got 4 or 5 years of cricket left in you and the status quo is acceptable when compared to an uncertain future it’s a no brainer.
In my opinion this Board is not reforming nor turning anything around. They’re under pressure to now, but they’re going to blame the economy and sanctions
and we will be back to normal dismal operations quicker than you can blink.
What would that interim board have done?
Although it’s unproven I’d put my family jewels on a block that at the very least they would have rehashed that Metbank loan. We’re now never going to see the real accounts of anything and the accusations of misappropriation will never be proven or disproven. ICC have been presented with enough information over the years and have done nothing, which was the reason why SRC got involved in the first place, it was not just a personal vendetta as ZC are suggesting. The only reason they hung on is because they’ve got a lot to hide and everything to lose. Anyway that chapter is closed and I believe we’ve lost out on substantial funds that we desperately need.
Would they get players back here?
I have my doubts. They’d be shooting for a small handful of unproven young guys that have other options and would not come back to uncertainty and a failed country. What would you offer a young unproven guy? There would be an uproar, and the likes of Byrom and Welch have futures in County, hard earned as well. Muyeye is the guy they need and they need to make sure Myers and a couple of the other youngsters don’t leave.
Would the DEB board cut the franchises?
Maybe, or at least reduce the squad sizes and they’d definitely cut some of the dead wood. The current Board’s philosophy is half feed more people, and it works! Everyone seems ok with that.
Would the DEB Board have enticed corporate sponsorship?
Absolutely. Not much because the economy is shagged, but it would come and it would grow. There would be more outside interest and they’d also do a hugely better job of marketing, social media and TV rights. I’d guarantee black corporate interest! They trust this board as much as the rest of us. There’s not much white corporate left anyway.
Would the DEB board have tried to make clubs independent?
Yes- -and this would have been a painful but necessary process. My pet hate being roaming clubs of no fixed abode.
Would the DEB board organize more games?
Yes, at every single level!!
Would the DEB board have gotten some white coaches and admin back?
Here we’re talking Streak, Campbell, Taibu and Flower specifically. This would have been contentious, but I believe they would have, but would have been mindful of opinion. There’s absolutely a role for Campbell, he’s got a lot of clout and we need an A side with top coaches.
Would there have been an all white franchise?
No never, but we need more white players and they will only come or stick around if they believe that they have representation at administrative level. They rightfully don’t trust this board or previous ones. I’d personally like to see a predominately white franchise, if they like each other’s company why not, they’re not plotting a coup. Why do we need white players? Because we keep producing some really good ones, but losing them.
I could pick a mostly white franchise side that would never ever lose a game here in any format against any opposition and that would cause the 4th Chimurenga and nobody wants to see that because it proves racism and maladministration of the highest order has existed for years. They just swapped the racism out and everyone is ok with it. Sadly it’s the acid test of what has happened to our cricket and a further acid test of where the nation is at is would the public find that acceptable? We all know the answer to that one. We’ve still got a way to go as a nation. It’s hypothetical but would Zimbabwe prefer a competitive 9/11 white team or a 4/7 team that gets dry humped all day every day? The answer is very simple- everyone will clamor for the competitive team...for about 5 games only, and then the allegations of racial bias would start all over again, proving most people have learnt Jack Shit.
How would the other franchises do against a young side comprising of
Byrom, B Curran, Muyeye, Welch, Burl, Myers, Murray, S Curran, Evans, Hopper, Snater, Lake? Let’s not forget young Goodwin, a superstar in the making.
Or a heavyweight side like
Byrom, Ballance, Cartwright, Taylor, Ervine, Williams, De Grandhomme, S Curran, T Curran etc
I’ll tell you what, the other franchise side’s openers or a Zim A side’s openers could bat twice and they’d still get smashed against this second side!
The cold truth is that only a handful of people believe in this board, amongst the others there’s genuine fear of an upheaval that won’t suit individuals. There’s this perception that whites in numbers constitute a threat and a barrier. There’s some truth in that, as much as black guys gravitate to one another so do we, some would call it cultural bias and the disingenuous would call it a racial bias. It’s all about tolerance and us Zimbos have all travelled a long road in this regard. There are more black folk that live in the past than there are whites, we know our boundaries and as a fact there aren’t any for the black guys, they can say and do as they like with complete impunity. The day we see a black guy get it for racism here or SA will be a cold day in hell and I don’t think it will happen in our lifetimes. A vast section of people don’t think there is such a thing as black on white racism, that’s how fucked up the situation is. We’ve got much bigger problems than race to deal with now though, but there’s a small section that will play the card to suit forever more.
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chesterton
- Posts: 104
- Joined: Sun Sep 08, 2019 8:40 pm
Re: Lifting of ZC suspension on the 8th
The smart players will back the current board as they will always find a way to win the power struggles with ZImbabwe, at least as long as ZANU are in power, although MDC are likely just as bad. Those backing the interim bord wrongly believed that the ICC wouldn't tolerate poor governance. The ICC has been backing poor governance for 15 years in regards to cricket in Zimbabwe, why would they change their stance now? If they had backed the white-led interim board some war veterans would have shown up to HSC and started digging up the pitch. The reach of those in ZC is far and wide and the players know this. I don't even feel safe on this board knowing the ZC agents could be lurking anywhere.
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sloandog
- Posts: 9940
- Joined: Wed Aug 26, 2009 11:28 am
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- Location: Manchester UK
Re: Lifting of ZC suspension on the 8th
Single figures
Re: Lifting of ZC suspension on the 8th
I think an Englishman, Aussie or New Zealander in ICC would object sooner to our ridiculous FC packages and discrepancies than someone from the sub-continent where the huge inequalities are the accepted norm- if you’re the boss you get the lion’s share, if you’re a worker then take it or leave it. It’s glum
Ridiculous
England took Gary Ballance, Sam Curran and Ben Curran from us ...We can include Greame Hicks..
New Zealand to Collin Grandhomme
Assuie to Cartwright
They should be ashamed to criticize us while they are taking our talented players
Ridiculous
England took Gary Ballance, Sam Curran and Ben Curran from us ...We can include Greame Hicks..
New Zealand to Collin Grandhomme
Assuie to Cartwright
They should be ashamed to criticize us while they are taking our talented players
Re: Lifting of ZC suspension on the 8th
Why Muddy, why?