[U19 World Cup] Zimbabwe vs Windies

[CrimsonAvenger]

Some of these self styled "commentators / experts" are coming out, and having not watched the match, are saying - "at the end of the day, the batsman should not leave the crease, blah blah blah..." Can they first watch it and realize that at no point he left the crease to gain undue advantage? Fools. Trying to also air their opinion on the matter because they are "experts".

"Let's try to put the emotions aside for a moment" it seems. My foot. You play sport because it gives you that adrenaline rush. It treats the ones who play it and those who watch it with a range of emotions over a short period of time. And a whole spectrum of emotions at that. That is the whole point of sport. And they are trying to reason this out saying "let's keep the emotions away". Fools again.

"But rules are rules". Agreed, but did the officials give themselves enough time to explore all options at such an important conjecture of the game and tournament? Remember that dead ball run out of Anderson in the WC that left JW Taylor stranded on 98* and the ICC later apologized? This was the last over of the match for heaven's sake. Nobody would have complained if they had taken another 5 minutes to arrive at the decision in consultation with the match referee. What is his role anyway if he does not intervene in such situations? Handing out post match fines?

I am not done with this, at least to feel better, I'll write a whole article about it, but that has to wait till Sunday... Last rant for the day.

[bayhaus]

We have to deal with this. Mangongo was right when ever we leave games to the last minute things always happen, Williams 6 at WC. Well for this one we have the rules of the game to thank. There fore we were beaten fairly. We may not like the way we lost but thats it. We were beaten. If its in the rules then its in the spirit of the game. What elese is in the rules of the game that is shunned upon as not being in the spirit of the game. I am tired of hearing about the 'spirit of the game' or that cricket is a 'gentleman's game' We must just get rid of these terms. If we dont like Mankad (which is just a run out anyway) then we should take it out of the rules of the game. Just stay in your crease and you will be fine. He was run out cos he wasnt in his crease. so he was on his way for a quick single, that distance could have been the difference between a run and and run out at the other end. So fair game.

Secondly, it's WITHIN THE RULES! We are living in the professional age where every minuscule tactic is pushed to its full advantage. Like the commentators have said, if it were baseball, the pitchers would be looking to catch batters creeping of their crease. It's logical, we just aren't used to it as a cricketing community.

Who's to say that Zimbabwe wouldn't have done the same thing? More opportunistic than bad sportsmanship

What is the situation was reversed and we had done the same and won I wonder if we would be in such a huff about it?

PS. Lets just ignore the rules and depend on the spirit of cricket.

[Kriterion_BD]

We have to deal with this. Mangongo was right when ever we leave games to the last minute things always happen, Williams 6 at WC. Well for this one we have the rules of the game to thank. There fore we were beaten fairly. We may not like the way we lost but thats it. We were beaten. If its in the rules then its in the spirit of the game. What elese is in the rules of the game that is shunned upon as not being in the spirit of the game. I am tired of hearing about the 'spirit of the game' or that cricket is a 'gentleman's game' We must just get rid of these terms. If we dont like Mankad (which is just a run out anyway) then we should take it out of the rules of the game. Just stay in your crease and you will be fine. He was run out cos he wasnt in his crease. so he was on his way for a quick single, that distance could have been the difference between a run and and run out at the other end. So fair game.

Secondly, it's WITHIN THE RULES! We are living in the professional age where every minuscule tactic is pushed to its full advantage. Like the commentators have said, if it were baseball, the pitchers would be looking to catch batters creeping of their crease. It's logical, we just aren't used to it as a cricketing community.

.

True. That millimeter at the end other end would have resulted in a within the spirit of the game run out at the other end. Its not different from a stumping where most of the time the dismissed batsman is not trying tk get an undue advnatage but is still stumped.


I can agree with Bishop that maybe such taxtics carry a stigma, like gay marriage which is legal in much of the west, its fair, but many people believe its against the spirit of matrimony. The only defense of this mankad incident would be that the batter should have been aware of the technical rule and that in such a tight game, the other side can stoop to anything to win.

Rashid Latif once claimed a catch he grassed to deny Bangladesh their first ever Test win in 2003.

Who's to say that Zimbabwe wouldn't have done the same thing? More opportunistic than bad sportsmanship

When the umpire's - farcically in my opinion ened the Pakistan game a few months ago - that too was perfectly within the laws of the game. But it was not in good spirit. Why bring players back to play 5 overs but decide 7 is too many? I'm sure Shoaib Malik felt cheated although he could have gotten out next ball with 21 still to get.

People keep referring to the Williams 6 from the world cup. But in that same game it was Williams who got a crucial wicket off a big no ball and was saved from a free hit which could have added an additional potential 4 or 6 runs to the target.

Then there was the Jordan run out vs Bangladesh. He made his ground but when the bails went off, his bat had bounced in the air and he was given out.

What is the situation was reversed and we had done the same and won I wonder if we would be in such a huff about it?

[/quote]

Pretty sure a few ZCF posters would have condemned it if the tables were turned. One of the reasons I post here is because fellows like sloandog and a handful of others have more integrity than almost all other posters on internet forums.

[eugene]

Mankad is within the rules. This is professional sport, not a game of beach cricket. Whatever it takes to win. Zimbabweans clearly lack this mentality.

[sloandog]

Might be in the rules, but the timing off its use here was nothing short of appalling. Win at all costs comes to mind. The over celebrations after it and the captains reluctance to show any sign of credit to Zimbabwe was awful. I'm not going to sit here and say 'it's within' the rules, because we know it is, it's the fact they used it during this point of a game, and the fact that he was probably in...

Shit umpiring today as well

[foreignfield]

What boggled me was how proud of themselves they were after they did it. Speaks volumes about them as individuals.

I'm not so sure it's got much to do with them as individuals. No kid just comes up with this idea all by himself. The way they executed the plan tells me it wasn't that new a thing for them. I was talking to a West Indian (apparently) on a different forum who claimed he was teaching his junior side mankading as a special skill, and that it was generally done. He felt immensely proud of them (and himself). I don't know if he was for real, but it gets one thinking.

I can honestly say that I would have been ashamed if the tables were turned. Sport is not about winning at all costs ... where that mentality prevails my interest and support ends.

[bayhaus]

Sport is not about winning at all costs ...

We are kidding ourselves if we buy that whole 'I play cricket for the love it.' Thats why we get belted cos we dont treat this like a professional sport. This is not for fun people are being paid huuuge amounts of money to go out and represent their countries and to earn livlihoods.

but the timing off its use here was nothing short of appalling.

What time would have been suitable for you SloanDog? Thats the problem with this whole issue, this why rules exist in sport so we dont depend on our emotions for decisions. We’re completely ignoring the laws cos of our feelings.

The over celebrations after it and the captains reluctance to show any sign of credit to Zimbabwe was awful.

Thats just being politically correct he is under no obligation to give Zimbabwe any credit.

The way they executed the plan tells me it wasn't that new a thing for them.

Good for them for knowing the rules and when to take advantage of them.

Funny thing is the way peeps here are seemingly frothing at the mouth just thinking about this 'injustice' I am also frothing at the mouth that WI are being shamed for excersing their rite to apply the rules of the game as they see fit. They have refused to be cowered to a standard of 'spirit of cricket' which is an imaginary line of which noone knows whether it is a straight line or a crooked line, whether its made of string wire or its just drawn in the sand.

And as for the Eng players who are talking spirit of cricket must petitioning their board to tour Zimbabwe in the spirit of cricket or just sit down and keep quiet. But again... There is freedom of speech!

Cricketing Crinkum Crankum

[foreignfield]

Sport is not about winning at all costs ...

We are kidding ourselves if we buy that whole 'I play cricket for the love it.' Thats why we get belted cos we dont treat this like a professional sport. This is not for fun people are being paid huuuge amounts of money to go out and represent their countries and to earn livlihoods.

Professional sport is part of the entertainment industry ... I don't say the Windies cheated ... but I as spectator/customer feel cheated because I was robbed of a thrilling finish. Tastes differ, though. Sorry for the football analogy, but the German national team of the eighties was a hugely succesful bunch of cynical, cheating, diving, win at all costs a******* -- I'm still embarrassed thinking about them. I was so pissed off with football for a time I turned to cricket! There is also a reason why I started to support Zim, and not the greatest side of the day, the all-conquering, bossy, sledging Aussies under Steve Waugh. In all those years I was often embarrassed by what happened off the field in Zim cricket, but never by the players and their actions on it.

[Kriterion_BD]

Everyone would have preferred the game to end after the ball had been delivered. But this event has caused me to think about an otherwise rare occurence. I think all batters will now be mindful and coaches should empasize that. I have always found it odd that batsmen advance before the ball has been bowled to begin with. But since everyone does it, its fair. I just thought it was odd.

[Yorker]

ZIMDOGGY once mentioned that a certain demographic of cricket players lack the subtle nuances of the traditional game. I witnessed it today. Someone said it's not illegal to bowl with headgear on but the umpire always reminds the bowler to take off such before they bowl (and this is just club cricket!). I don't think England, SA or even Zim will ever be desperate enough to mankad.